Microsoft has a majority market share

I am in 97% agree with us but, let's be fair and tell all that:
1. All the PC's for sale shoud be clean and, when I go to buy it, to decide what I want to have and the store to install it for me.
2. Ubuntu shoud be marketed in his way (the amazing way). It's an serious OS user-friendly, but, like all in his gang (well almost all distros) not idiot-friendly.
3. Totally agree with just one adnotation: The user itself must be upgrade it. :-)))

Here, in Romania, only the big magazines are selling the PC'es with windoze preinstaled, the little ones are selling their systems with Linux (various distros) but installed in a manner that makes the computer useless. :-))

Easily reproduceable in Southern California. I recently visited 3 different computer stores and could not find a single system running a free and open operating system. At one location, when I attempted to boot an Ubuntu LiveCD, I was asked to leave the premises! Shocking...I think the severity level very well could be raised on this one.

I was able to reproduce this problem in an average of 85% of the cases. Seeing as this flaw concerns over ~85% of the worlds computer users, I think it should be given the highest severity rating.

This bug is extremely prevelant in Australia We may need aid packages!

My status: Currently working on bugfix

This bug is dangerously widespread in Sweden as well.

My current status: Working on bugfix

In Belgium the bug is extremely widespread, so much that people don't see it as a bug anymore and accept it as a fact of life... Must fix...

In Poland this bug is not as significant as elsewhere, as most of ready-made computers are sold with FreeDOS or some flavour of Linux (Aurox and Mandriva predominantly). The only exception are the laptops, where only HP and Acer sell notebooks without Microsoft software preinstalled.
Maybe this is because in Poland we aren't as rich as people in other countries?

I strongly disagree with Jarek. Of course, Poles are poor. It's true we buy computers with DOS (but rather DR-DOS to make it more "legal") or even Linux, but let's face the facts - the first thing people do on their new computers is installing pirated Windows copies. So the bug is even more significant, only not so obviously seen in PC stores. More significant because elsewhere (in more "civilised" countries) people can afford to buy Windows, only we know they pay money which then is used to stop innovation in software (among other evil things), but in Poland people are not only making market for Windows (use illegaly at home, then make your boss buy it at the office, because Windows is what you want to work on), but also stealing software (which is not right even if for some reasons we don't like the software or company in question). In case of Windows, Microsoft is silently agreeing to steal it (due to reasons mentioned earlier), but it creates the wrong assumption in users' minds (that it's OK to steal software at home, because we can't afford it). What people doesn't _realize_ is the fact that all of their computer work can be done with free software. I'm not talking about proffessionals using some bizzarre advanced tools. I'm talking about people using computers to browse web, send e-mail, talk to friends and print few pages a day at work. So this is the bugfix - end user education. Working on it :)

Here in Brazil there is a manufacturer which is starting to distribute a custom Ubuntu as its default operating system option!

Here in Indonesia the bug is very serious widespreaded. We trying hard to fix the bug.

Couple months ago, Microsoft Indonesia sweeped all internet cafe that using illegal copy of Windows, after that moment most of internet cafe using Linux as it's operating system. It's a good start to introducing Linux to Indonesian.

Now, most of Computers store installed Linux in newly build computers (including laptop).

In Mozambique, Africa computers are not so widespread, let alone Windows or Ubuntu. All the computer shops that I know have Windows pre-installed on it (mostly pirated). Linux is only known to ISP's and companies that need a fileserver.
The bug hasnt got a stronghold here yet since there aren't as many computers. A little help from outside might just stop the bug before it can infest everywhere.

I think this bug has been introduced by a design mistake concerning the function create_software_industry(). It should have a variable parameter list rather than a sole pcompany attribute.

Until someone starts talking to Microsoft users, Ubuntu will never be in the high street.

Talk to hosting companies and it'll be in hosting companies. *Newsflash: The general public don't use hosting companies*

If we do not market to a wider audience, market opinion will never swing in our favour. The most you can get is what you ask for - you will never be given nore.

If you actually want to do something instead of sittng around and complaining, get the debate: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=73132

Scrub that - join the marketing team:

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MarketingTeam

This bug is especially evident in Portugal. Most computer stores are barely aware anything not related to windows.
Most large computer store atendants will look strangelly if you ask them anything about linux. That or they will say that store does not support Linux at all.

Don't fool yourselves.
Most Computer stores in my country sell counterfit copies of windows, and even tho most stores make you pay for fake goods no one cares about that, not even microsoft. Babies grow up spoon fed by windows and they will one day be spoon fed windows adults.

If at all possible this bug could have to do with the inability, or disconfort in most peoples mind that seems to tell them that Microsoft windows works and Linux might not.

There should be a Forum in which people would put their success stories about what they installed and how. What is supported and what isn't. This is missing in practicly all distros I've seen.
We in the linux world must make sure people can find out if their computer works in Ubuntu.
Marketing needs to be planned. If you market your solution just because you have it, then if you fail your image is burnt.

My little girl is six years old and spends hours on the computer playing educational games. Unfortunately the games she is interested in are only available on Microsoft - so as long as the suppliers of such software do not have the motivation to supply for the linux market the bug will perpetuate. That said, my little boy will be getting a motherboard, chassis, power supply, hard disk, cd/dvd drive and a linux cd when he turns six :-)

I can reproduce it too, in France, in either small shops & big supermarkets.

I'm working on a bugfix for several years, with many, many people.

Maybe this one will take some time to hunt. But I feel we're on the way.

I was able to repeat this bug in rural western Pennsylvania (USA) as well. Furthermore we have public schools that have not one open-source program installed on their computers!

I know there are open source projects out there for schools but is there an open source how-to or step-by-step program for integrating open source programs into a public school system?
Its great to have the software but we need a way to educate the educators on how to implement and use the software!

We should also have a how-to attack plan: This would cover how someone (like me, an open source advocate) approaches a local school about using open source.

There's only one thing I have to say about this bug:

"lol"

I was able to reproduce in the UK. In fact, in one instance, I couldn't even get a PC with a blank HDD, nevermind with Linux on!

There is a big chance for the asian market to squash this bug. We can actally buy HP and IBM laptops with no Operating systems. Linux is currently making the news (along with Ubuntu) and UNDP-APDIP initiatives like the IOSN are helping to fix this bug.

I am able to reprodce it in Burma --- a South-East Asia country known for its main opposition leader and Nobel laureate, Daw Aung San Suu Kyi.

Our country has refused to sign the international copyright and patent laws up to now. So it is perfectly legal to use pirated software!(Mostly MS Windows and related products) Even MS, with its enormous legal team, cannot sue us!

There is almost no software industry here. PC clones are assembled and sold with pirated Windows, and any popular software you name, pre-installed by hardware vendors, who also undertake the responsibility of Windows help desk. All other software maintenance is done by users themseves by using manuals (pirated copies again!) and learning from private software courses.

However, things must change sooner or later. At the time when the International IP laws come into effective here, all computers in Burma would grind to a halt since very few would be able to afford license fees.

Who would help us to boot our computers at that time? Ubuntu, I hope.

As far as I am concerned, this behavior works as expected. It should be marked as a feature, not a bug.

If Steve Balmer can vow to kill Google, then I'm equally entitled to kill Microsoft. I will commit whatever free time I have to improve Ubuntu, and I won't rest until this bug is resolved.

I must ask a question, this bug that faces not only Ubuntu/Kubuntu etc but Linux in general what is it really caused by?

1) Is it caused by unfair practices by certian large businesses?
2) Is it caused by customers that do not know more about Linux?

We all know I guess that its caused by a combination of both. If Linux is to expand rapidly to the desktop user then more education is needed for the public. I live in South Africa (Western Cape) and here 99% of PC shops either just don't support Linux or for some reason have not heard of it.

Come on, lets educate people who do not know the joys of Linux and especially Ubuntu

I see this bug time to time. I am not talking about the average joe who doesn't even know what an OS is. But, I am talking about Computer Scientists. Yes, you heard me right. Fellow students in my Computer Science degree, are as addicted to Windows as Hippies were addicted to "LOVE" in the 60s ;-) . Our university(University of Southampton, UK), has invested a lot of time, money and effort into providing us with a room full of Linux PCs with latest hardware. Yet, we see students flocking to M$ Windows PCs.

Bug Fixes:

   1. User awareness/education - I am working on it. So far managed to convert my brother and four of my friends. Though, few revert to M$ often, due to hardware incompatibilities, with time these issues can be resolved.
   2. Advocate the fact the UBUNTU is free - Yes, your PC would be a lot cheaper if it wasn't for all the pre-installed software. May be with the saving you can afford better peripherals or even a high spec PC. As abdulmueid commented above[in bug#1's comments page], the use of Linux based computers is the only way for computers to become widely available in developing countries. Mmmm will they still be called developing countries then...
   3. Advertise in YELLOW Pages/Directory Listings for free Ubuntu consultations - LUGs are a good idea. But people are hesitant while venturing into the unknown(to them that is). So may be the LUGs can advertise, offering help in local news papers, TVs etc.
   4. Awareness initiatives - Government should allocate funds to create awareness among people. National Televisions should telecast programmes during prime time-slots, to advise people about the open source software. I think, people wouldn't want to break the law when there is a legal and free alternative. Why pirate MS Office when you can use Open Office? Why get all the spam, spy ware, virus?

Well, all this is my objectives for the future. I am just waiting for my chance. Until then I am just preparing myself and doing whatever I can to help.

"Small drops make the mighty ocean"

So do your bit to help....

-- Saru

In 2 opportunities I have visited the Technology Section of 3 big department stores in Chile (Falabella, Almacenes Paris and Ripley). I have requested to buy even the most powerful and expensive computer they have (either desktop or laptop) but with NO operating system.

After some minutes, the very motivated sales persons come back with sad face to inform me that their supervisors have not allowed the procedure because OS is already installed.

Incredible!

I suggest we organize the Ubuntu Request Day. What's that? Let's ask each ubuntu fan to go to a store one day (same for all over the world) and ask to buy a computer with Ubuntu (Kubuntu, Edubuntu, or maybe Debian installed).

Obviously, if by any case, the store agrees... we may have some excuses already planned :)

We could ask vendors about machines without windows pre-installed
I have seen in my contry (Romania) that almost all laptops (90%)
are with windows home/pro already on them .
There are some vendors that give you choice :Acer and Siemens sell some models
with linux.

One intersting article related to this bug
"Early results of the (Dutch) Windows refund survey"
"Sometimes as a Linux user, you wish you could buy any computer with Linux preinstalled, or if that's not possible, just without an operating system, but that's not the reality. If that isn't possible, is it possible to buy any computer with Windows pre-installed, and then, return the unused Windows, and ask a refund for it? That's a question many non-Windows users ask themselves. The answer however, isn't clear to consumers. There's only one way to find out: ask your hardware manufacturer. Or do they neither know the answer? Time to find out."

http://lxer.com/module/newswire/view/49036/index.html

Ok I found a major part of this bug. I finaly confinced a friend to go to linux, in the form of ubuntu. He LOVED it. Couldn't stop talking about the speed and ease of use and all that. Then it happened. We went to install a game. When it didn't work he looked at me and asked how do I get my games working. I then told him for most games you can use Cedega or wine, but some don't work at all yet, you also need no cd cracks for some also. At the point he looked at me and said, wait you mean I have to buy a program to get most my games working..then some wont work..and some that do I have to use a no cd crack....Just install windows. I would rather have all my games working. So there you have it. We fix this gameing prob and we can get more users. Most that I see switch right back when they find out about games and linux. They dont want to have to install new stuf then hope their game is supported. If we can some how make it work out the box on all games like windows we will be set.

I completely agree with Nal's comment about games, with one slight change. I don't think the problem is getting games to work in Linux. I think the REAL problem is getting game designers to make a Linux version of their games (shipped on the SAME CD..) Why not? Just have 3 folders: DATA (for the game data files, Windows (for the windows runtimes) and Linux (for the Linux runtimes). That way save files from the games would transer easily, MORE people would buy the games (think of how much community support whichever company was the first to implement and advertise this would get!), and people that don't know any better could still just put in the CD and hit Install. Obviously there are A LOT of details to work out here, but I think that if Mark Shuttleworth wants to advance opensource, he should try kicking a large amount of money toward the first company like EA or Activision that would be willing to have static-compiled linux binaries of their games included on the CD. Even ONE of their popular games to start out. That game would sell MANY more copies that it otherwise would, and if it was implemented in such a way that followed software standards, EVERYONE would win (the game company who would sell more games and get LOTS of great PR on sites like Slashdot, the End User who would really get a fair choice of desktop os AND get to play the hot new game title, and the OSS community who would get a HUGE amount of exposure to people who would otherwise not be as interested). How about World of Warcraft?! My $0.02

This must be the biggest bug of all. I have been to many contries through out the world and have been to almost every major city in the USA. This is defently a confirmed bug.
M$ has plagued the entire world like a out of control virus spreading there software on the un-knowing. Their evil business practices have brought them market dominance and thus this bug must be eleminated.
I vote this bug must have the highest priority and I will also continue to assist in eleminating virus as well.

Present on my university campus, too. While a lot of the backend uses Mac OS X, most of the student-accessable computers are running some form of MS operating system. One lab offers an older version of Gentoo as an option, but it's the only place where I can use a free system on campus other than my dorm room. Furthermore, due to drastic price cuts (the school has a contract with Microsoft to allow their students onto the local "site license" for 10x the cost of media), there's little incentive for things to change.

I have been recommending free software to anyone who comes to me looking for computer help, and have even distributed LiveCDs of Ubuntu to anyone who comes to me for technical support in an effort to get people to consider leaving Windows.

Yep, in the Netherlands this is a major bug. The vast majority of system deals include the SMODNIM-system (get it? It's Window's newest nickname).

I'm amazed at how hard to kill this bug is. Most nonbelievers are totally focussed on the disadvantages of Linux, but I made my dad swap to Linux and I'm talking many unhappy SMODNIM-users into letting me install that system that is so good "and this is for free?"

People really liked Firefox and Thunderbird and really feel the difference and the vibe the open source community can give. SMODNIM should be very afraid, because people are switching!

Indeed, games are strongly affected by this bug. I would like to add a few suggestions. First off, go to garagegames.com, and buy some of the linux games. The games there are all very high quality despite being low-budget. Second, if you're a game developer, consider using a multi-platform OpenGL engine for your game, as opposed to DirectX. Third, if you're a linux developer, find a way to distribute programs in such a way as to not require a separate binary for every distro/processor combo out there! These files should be easy to use and install, and should not necessitate compiling. Some people might not want to release their source.

This generalised bug is persistent. Microsoft trains its salesforce to learn about GNU/Linux and use arguments against it.
As of the tasks to overcome the current situation I dare to propose:
1. make GNU/Linux and between them Ubuntu distributions be known using a ear-to-ear strategy
2. make Ubuntu distributions easy to configure and to update, for breaking the myth GNU/Linux requires technical or plenty-of-free-time users
3. ensure as many language tranlations as possible, giving the opportunity to feel confident by using an own language version to more people
4. make Ubuntu become widespread so that people know there is the possibility to choose - usually many do not even know that free sotware exists
5. focus on more "convertable" users:
5.1. business are not likely to switch easily but administrations or educational institutes might;
5.2. the younger seem to be more attracted than the elder; 5.3. emerging and poorer countries have more potential of growth if distributions are suitable to the hardware and telecoms options

And probably more, but we should focus on those at least.
In order to start, each of us can contribute to the distribution evolution, install at our homes, worksplaces if allowed and firends computers. This cold be the best advertisment campaign.

In German schools it is becoming nightmarish... kids are actually taking so-called Computer Classes and the first courses they can get their hands on is M$ Excel and Word because that is, they learn, what a Computer is All About! It seems as we are rather losing the knowledge of what a computer actually is; for our kids do not ever grasp the fact that what they are learning is bullsh.. and has nothing to do with computers. So I believe this bug is even more serious than we might have imagined...

Bug #29194 has Lithuanian translation of this bug, but bug #29194 is targeted to Baltic states (Lithuania and Latvia).
Also there is an issue with standards and document formats - government institutions and public sector shouldn't force users to use closed formats and non-free software, but currently lots of info in government institution web pages are only in closed document formats, like Microsoft Office (.doc or .xls).

Mark Shuttleworth worte:
"Non-free software is holding back innovation in the IT industry, restricting access to IT to a small part of the world's population and limiting the ability of software developers to reach their full potential, globally."

Uh, so is Rosetta, Malone, and the whole launchpad is holding back innovation too? ;-)

There are many reasons that causes MS to dominate the software market. In my opinion the following issues must be addressed by the Open Source community before they can even consider to appeal to the masses.
<ol><li>User Friendliness - When have you ever had to execute a command in terminal to do something in Windows....commands are for geeks - write a visual app for everything</li><li>Third party software support - This will naturally follow after (1.) is implemented - but think of all the apps that gets used in a business environment that has no linux support - Adobe, Macromedia, etc</li><li>Games + Entertainment - Everyone who's ever got a new cellphone should have realised before that things don't really sell on their usefull features, but more on their entertainment related features</li></ol>Implement these things into Ubuntu, and it will appeal to the masses!

here follows my post again without html tags:

There are many reasons that causes MS to dominate the software market. In my opinion the following issues must be addressed by the Open Source community before they can even consider to appeal to the masses.

1. User Friendliness - When have you ever had to execute a command in terminal to do something in Windows....commands are for geeks - write a visual app for everything

2. Third party software support - This will naturally follow after (1.) is implemented - but think of all the apps that gets used in a business environment that has no linux support - Adobe, Macromedia, etc

3. Games + Entertainment - Everyone who's ever got a new cellphone should have realised before that things don't really sell on their usefull features, but more on their entertainment related features.

In conclusion: Implement these things into Ubuntu, and it will appeal to the masses!

On Wed, Dec 14, 2016 at 1:20 PM, Tom <email address hidden> wrote:
> A few years ago some study allegedly found that 80%
> of computer usage is now done using tablets and phones.

You mean 80 % of the computer usage that nobody really needs is now
done using tablets and phones. Apart from storekeepers that nowadays
do their checklists and confirm their good receipts via tablet I
barely see people doing their real work via phone or tablet (at least
apart from writing emails). Or would you say 80 % of the computer work
is e-mailing. mmmhh - could even be... ;-)

> [...]
> This bug was first raised when the word "desktop" covered all the
> form-factors that could be used in small-business and by families or other
> private usage. Nowadays the term "desktop", even if expanded to include
> laptops, only represents under 20% of that market.

My experience is, that everybody still uses desktop or laptop - at
least for the more sophisticated work. I don't know a single person
who owns just a phone or tablet and not also a desktop or laptop
computer. Of course I would put desktops and laptop together in the
group. Anyway, Bug 1 is not fixed yet!

Best regards, Martin.

bug 1 is a platform monopoly problem. In the case of Ebay, Uber, Airbnb, Windows, most people are on each of these platforms, because, well, everyone else is on that platform. Not because the platform is better.

Fortunately, it seems there is a bugfix emerging for the plaform monopoly problem, and its called crowdacting.

crowdacting.org

it will take some time before truly massive migration like a windows to linux migration is possible, but smaller migrations are sure to start taking place and inspiring larger migrations.

Let us ponder for a moment on the Founding Bug of Ubuntu. Now that Shuttleworth has accepted to port Ubuntu as the official platform for the Windows Subsystem for Linux. Maybe it is time to think about that "fix released". I know, « the world has changed », « we've come to better terms »... Microsoft does NOT change. You don't "come to better terms" with Microsoft, you leave your project be abducted by Microsoft.

I think our fellow Mark closed this bug too soon. Too hastily.

So long as WSL exists, the bug will exist.

PC and laptop times are not over, no, tablets and mobile phones are
not an alternative. Alternative devices may obsolete a PC at many
places, but: For those who want a PC or laptop if they go to a shop,
they still pretty everywhere only find Windows. There should be some
hardware that comes preinstalled with Linux/Ubuntu (and maybe not only
the old slow hardware), but this is not the case (neither for the
older hardware).

So this bug is very clearly not-solved. It might be obsolete, if
Android is used on PCs also and even the CAD users have there software
running on Android also.

Martin.

I suggest changing the title of this bug to :

"Non-free systems have a majority market share"

which is certainly the original intended idea of this bug.

(Of course Google Android is not a free system because it contains non-free Google Mobile Services.)

And therefore re-opening the bug.

I'm using Ubuntu since 8.04, and have noticed something. It was improving with every single release, but since 12.04 I don't see neither the progress nor at least stability: it is getting worse. The 16.04 tortures me with many glitches on the daily basis, and I found here a bug report already submitted by other people for every problem I have. Most of those reports are YEARS old and still are UNASSIGNED. This tells me: Ubuntu doesn't give a s**t to user experience and bug reports any more.
So I think this particular bug will never be resolved, at list because no one cares. And, btw, Ubuntu became so s**tty that I switched to other distro after many years with Ubuntu.

On Thu, Mar 9, 2017 at 12:20 PM, Boris Malkov <email address hidden> wrote:
> I'm using Ubuntu since 8.04, and have noticed something. It was improving with every single release,
> but since 12.04 I don't see neither the progress nor at least stability: it is getting worse.

I am not an Ubuntu developer, but as far as I know, lately most things
happening, happen in the background / under the hood (e.g. X11
replacement). And of course this might cause more bugs rising
(temporary). And yes, I also experience some issues, such as
[Bug 792085] Re: Automatic remount of safely removed USB 3.0 drive
which finally got fixed (even if on launchpad it is not yet marked as
fix released).
But I am still fine with the overall stability and I use Ubuntu all
day on my primary work laptop and several other machines/devices.

> The 16.04 tortures me with many glitches on the daily basis, and I found here a bug report already submitted by other people for every
> problem I have. Most of those reports are YEARS old and still are UNASSIGNED.

I found 2 bugs you are following which are older. One is Bug #304345:
"File chooser dialog doesn't provide network access" - which is a
duplicate of another bug which has been fixed. The other is Bug
#971219: "Remmina Crashes with when connecting to some RDP hosts"
which in reality is not an Ubuntu issue only. People write that it
depends on the certificate on the remote Windows machine. And oh yes,
there is a third issue that is related to launchpad itself. Is that
what you identify as reduced overall Ubuntu stability? What I see at
co-workers and customers what they fight with Windows, I am still way
better off with Linux.

> This tells me: Ubuntu doesn't give a s**t to user experience and bug reports any more.
> So I think this particular bug will never be resolved, at list because no one cares.
> And, btw, Ubuntu became so s**tty that I switched to other distro after many years with Ubuntu.

My experience is that the better details on a problem you serve the
better the answer is, what you get.
So maybe try to provide more exact details on your problems to help
the developers finding the bug faster.

Best regards, Martin.

Regards from Kaliningrad, Russia

That bug is being fixed here partially by now, see below.

Just to make sure, I visited some PC shops around and, to my surprise, found some computers with Ubuntu and few with FreeDOS (and, as consultant said, any linux distro from list could be installed for free).

The fun is what some own Linux distro is used (AFAIK) by Russian Ministry of Internal Affairs, and there is military Rosa linux (totally shitty from what I heard but still).
If only we could make schools to teach students to use Linux systems instead, that would change the game.

I estimate the prevalence of free software in education here as about 15-18%, maybe 25% based on what I see in university.

Sorry RMS, we pissed off everything!